[approachable]

Hello,

How is everyone?

Sarah Palin, who is John MCain's Vice Presidential pick, is a conservative Republican whose views are against abortion and homosexual relationships, probably being more rigid than MCain (according to my judgment, after hearing the media and reading a couple of short articles), of whom had some controversy about his stance on this issue [abortion] before his Saddleback church speech. However, my reason for sending this comes from the principle of leadership. Does the fact that women aren't supposed to usurp authority over a man in the church (I Timothy 2:11-15) apply also to leadership outside the church, particularly in this case, the White House?

So far, I'm for the MCain/Palin pick for November particularly because of their stances mentioned above (and because I'm a Christian, and realize the spiritual dangers in society as it relates to abortion and homosexuality). However, my conscience isn't clear as it relates to a woman Vice President in the White House.

Thank you and God bless........

[m273p15c]

Hi!

Thanks for the good question! My understanding of Scripture is that women should not seek positions of authority over men - be it in the church, political, or business. Why? Paul's basis for women being in subjection came from the order established at creation (God created woman second; woman fell first - I Timothy 2:12-14). Worship is just one application of this broader observation and principle. There may be some seemingly strange implications from this on many aspects of life. I would be happy to discuss those in another thread...

That being said, I think a good dose of "realism" is required here. Realistically, either Obama or McCain will be president. If we fail to vote for one, we are in essence voting for the other, even if we do not cast a ballot. That is an unavoidable, practical consequence of our 2-party system. Therefore, I take a "lesser of the evils" approach. I am not overjoyed in McCain's liberal views of religion, and I wish a man could have been found with Palin's talents and convictions. However, I am far more terrified of Barak Obama's and Biden's abysmal convictions. A democratic Congress and White house would be a moral nightmare! I could not live with myself if I let them waltz into power uncontested by my vote. ... As I said, I personally take a practical, "lesser of the evils" approach, so I plan to vote Palin & McCain. However, I am open to other opinions. ... Or, I may just write in a crackpot, like myself. (Actually, I would not throw away my vote like that, or on any other independent, but I sure feel like making a statement some times, even if it only makes me feel better for the moment.)

Hope this helps!
_________________
May God help us to love truth sincerely and supremely (II Thessalonians 2:11-12)

[approachable]

Hi again,

Thanks for the reply, m273p15c. Your referencing of the creation account was sound, as it relates to women leadership, whether in the secular realm or the church. Since the church of the Lord wasn't in the creation account, it's obvious that male leadership reaches back further than the church. Thanks for your reply, again.

Also, I wanted to add to your statement about Palin's talents and convictions. I hear that Palin also wants creationism taught alongside evolution in the science class of public schools. She says that, to her, there is nothing wrong with debating the 2 views. (Note: You can do a Google search and type in something like: Sarah Palin and Creationism, and you'll find various articles that speak of her stance on this.) I really like her convictions on creationism. However, I must say, that the 2 (evolution & creationism) are so different, that it doesn't seem possible to teach one without completely discarding the other, whether on a scientific level, or, even moreso, from a biblical perspective. Also, one is taught with the benefit of civil law (evolution), while the other is taught from the word of God (creationism), which they currently won't allow to be taught in the school system. A culture war this is, indeed.

Well, I won't speak too much about this. Maybe evolution will be held to more scrutiny in the secular public eye if it's challenged even in the least bit in the schools by creationism, and it's influence possibly weaken when shown inconsistent to a belief in God, the Creator. I'll be praying for this. God, of course, is in control.......

In concluding this reply, I wanted to reference a couple of sources where everyone who reads the forum can go if they're interested in good material as it relates to the Christian and the direction America is going.......

There is a recent article by Wayne Jackson called: Voting: Option or Obligation? at www.christiancourier.com

Also, most brethren may know about the DVD by brother Dave Miller called: The Silencing of God. This can be ordered at www.apologeticspress.org. You can order it from the WebStore/Catalog section of the site. I'll leave you all with a description (copy and pasted from the DVD advertisement, see below) of what's on the DVD. May you all be blessed...........


The Silencing Of God

Take a trip back to the withered roots and vanishing values of America’s past. You will not believe your eyes and ears. America is in the throes of a full-scale culture war.

The Dismantling Of America’s Christian Heritage

Did the Founding Fathers...

-advocate “separation of church and state?”

-reject expressions of Christianity in government and public schools?

-intend for federal institutions to be religiously neutral?

-approve of same-sex marriage?

The moral and spiritual underpinnings of American civilization are collapsing.

“A must see for every American”

The Silencing of God Seminar issues a stirring plea to the nation to...

-Return from the depths of moral depravity

-Reclaim our Christian heritage

-Reaffirm Biblical values in public life

[thetruth1]

hey,
i have a question
do you think women shouldn't teach over men only because of what the bible says? or is there a non-religious reason too? I think women are great for teaching men, as they have many valuable lessons to teach men. but i don't believe in the bible, so don't feel obligated to hit me with bible verses.

On the McCain/Palin thing i think voting for president doesn't matter since it's the electoral collage that decides the president and only some states have laws where the electors have to vote the peoples way, although most electors do that anyway to get reelected. Setting that aside if you look at Obama's and McCain policies and voting you can see they don't differ much on key issues, such as the war and the Federal reserve. I know this is a religious forum so important topics such as abortion and gay rights do differ but McCain has changed his views so many times it's impossible to know what he'll do.
One of the ten commandments is "thou shalt not murder" right? Well both candidates support the murder of innocent people in the middle east. Some say that they are terrorists that have harmed American innocents but by us bombing them, disbanding their national army, and occupying their land we are creating more terrorists than ever before. In the end this is more harmful to us as a nation. Also spending trillions on wars we can't afford is going to put America in debt which, of course, we will never pay off, creating more future poverty of the country as a whole.
Both McCain and Obama do not understand the economy at this crucial time and their actions will be very harmful, leading to a depression that might last 10 years instead of 1 year. We are going into a depression no debate about that, lets just hope that the people wont kneel down to socialism or fascism.
In your last post you talk about "The silence of god" I didn't see the movie so ill just talk about what you posted.

It seems like from what you wrote that the movie advocates creating a national religion, which would be completely opposite to what the founders intended. It doesn't seem to have any predilections to rights or choice of religion. Do you really believe that Christianity should be imposed upon every one here in the U.S.?
I read somewhere that Christianity is meant to be found by people through their want to find god or something.
I hope you change your mind about what government should be about or maybe i just misunderstood you.
---Im not religious by the way, so if u you respond just use your own thinking and no bible verses.
If you think exactly what the bible says and need to quote it please don't respond.

thanks =D